4thplacetrophy
Well-Known Member
he also forgot to mention that he got stoned on a breakaway
on a good save so i wouldn't worry, it was real nice free kick though. i don't think he booked me but yeah he threatened too.
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Pakenham Cup Pakenham Cup 2009 - Quarterfinals
- Thread starter Yoda
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on a good save so i wouldn't worry, it was real nice free kick though. i don't think he booked me but yeah he threatened too.
Carniehore
New Member
what i would like to know is who refs the refs ? basically the ref is there to make sure that we play the game correctly (some better than others hahahaha) who is there to make sure that the ref makes the right calls and what punishment do they get if they continue to make bad calls or power trip etc ? it seems to be the same refs over and over again that cause problems, in turn frustration comes out in the players (which is natural) then bad tackles bad attitudes all come to the surface and the game gets out of hand !!! so if anyone knows who refs the refs i would love to know !!!
I wonder the same thing, do these guys actually get spoken to seriously when they ref an absolute shocker or is there such a ref shortage that they just keep the guys happy that they got. I don't take many red cards but when I have gone in front of the kangaroo court they make it seem like you are this bad human being or you have comitted a serious crime. What happens when the same ref is getting complaints all the time? I'm sure I am not the only one that gets that sense of dread when you see a certain ref walking up to the park in a big game.
Carniehore
New Member
it feels sometimes that they are there to pick up the paycheck and we are there to play this fantastic game !!!! now im not saying all of them but i think maybe the refs should have a love for the game understand the rules and emotions that flow through the players when we are playing..... the last game i played was against mission in the quarter finals and the reffing was horrible !! horrible !! and this is coming from the winning team !!!! i have seen better reffing in church soccer .... NO JOKE !!!! thats a disgrace !! we get fined when our paper work is not organized or handed in with the wrong font but nothing happens to the refs when they "shat the sheets" in an important game. we need something maybe on the team sheet to mention the thing(s) the ref needs to work on (if need be). we have to be heard as players and coachs !!! remember without us there would be no LEAGUE and no money for the execs. thats my 2 cents !! maybe im wrong let me know ?
Carniehore for president?
its on the wondersite and is supposed to be filled in after every game good ref or bad ....if you dont do it you have no complaints
Carniehore
New Member
i care zero !! one message to the refs in the league dont punish a team because of one player or ur here for the wrong reasons and i remember something my father taught me a long time ago..... "if the other team doesnt touch the ball .....it takes the ref out the game"
game plan in effect ....hopefully hahahahaha
This raises a point that I have wanted explained to me for some time. Hopefully a ref will reply. How does a ref prepare for a game? I don't mean as in warm up, but throught the day and in the car on the way to the game. Does he want to be a part of a great game? Do they think in their heads how they can avoid things that went badly in other games? Is reffing a Pak Cup game any different than another game? Do they know if it's a game where 1st place is on the line? Yes, we are fortunate to have a few really good refs out there, it just seems so few and far between.
Yes, I think that's the case. I don't see many of us on the back nine of our playing days lining up to become officials. I sure as hell have better things to do w/ my time, and better ways to stay invloved in the game.
In our single Pak game vs. Poco, we were lucky to have a first class ref that clearly went to the park w/ the intent on being part of a great match. You barely knew he was there. They are few and far in between.
That being said, I will take Whistleblower anytime we play the Rangers in the future.
whistle blower
Active Member
Ok i will say my piece on behalf of the ref's out there, your statement seems very funny to me as the same could be said about players. For a ref at the beginning of a game it does not matter who is playing and what they did the last time you reffed them, but it seems out of the 15 plus players on there team the problem player will do something stupid, so now a ref has to sort out the situation and people like you come on TTP and write stupid statements on the reffs performance. If fouls are not committed,dissent is not shown i am very happy to run around the soccer field then go home and not have to do reports and i am very sure every ref feels that way.
P.S. check out the BC Soccer web site for a referee's course and sign up my friend, if you think there is a ref problem out there this is the only way to fix it.
RefsRef
whistle blower
Active Member
Now you have really pissed me off, i will tell you how much i get paid to be on the executive $1400 last year. Now i have to put in at least 15 to 20 hours a week 9 months a year,pay for my own gas to do the leagues business and no expense account.
Team fine to go the LEAGUE ask your coach he was handed the statement of all the accounts at the AGM.
Kevin Uppal
johnnybluenose
Well-Known Member
Look, fact remains refs are a part of the game.
Everyone has their good and bad days, some more than others, just like players & coaches.
We have all played long enough to know who is who and how they handle games, you have to adjust accordingly. It is just the way it is.
Coming on here ranting and raving will get you nowhere with peers (ie players/managers/referees/casual observers/league administrators/etc)
I would like to hear from a ref what Utah asked though... I have never thought about that.
I saw a special on Gol or FSWC or something about Referees at the pro level and the clinics and camps they attend and wonder if that is something local senior soccer refs do.
Most players train once a week and play once or twice a week.
As they say, practice makes perfect right... Does the same apply to refs? I know if guys are not coming to training the coaches will often not start them in favour of someone who is a regular at training. Can the same be said for Refs?
and like utah asked. I know on game days I think about the game, eat a meal that will not bog me down more than I usually do myself, try to drink lots of water throughout the day etc.
do ref's actually prepare and train? (generally speaking) or is it a matter of getting your badge and just reffing as many games as you can?
~ inquiring minds
Everyone has their good and bad days, some more than others, just like players & coaches.
We have all played long enough to know who is who and how they handle games, you have to adjust accordingly. It is just the way it is.
Coming on here ranting and raving will get you nowhere with peers (ie players/managers/referees/casual observers/league administrators/etc)
I would like to hear from a ref what Utah asked though... I have never thought about that.
I saw a special on Gol or FSWC or something about Referees at the pro level and the clinics and camps they attend and wonder if that is something local senior soccer refs do.
Most players train once a week and play once or twice a week.
As they say, practice makes perfect right... Does the same apply to refs? I know if guys are not coming to training the coaches will often not start them in favour of someone who is a regular at training. Can the same be said for Refs?
and like utah asked. I know on game days I think about the game, eat a meal that will not bog me down more than I usually do myself, try to drink lots of water throughout the day etc.
do ref's actually prepare and train? (generally speaking) or is it a matter of getting your badge and just reffing as many games as you can?
~ inquiring minds
This deserves the immortality quoting gives us.
I for one have always supported an executive pay scale. We have these guys do a shite load of work, and often all they are doing is seeing that work hit the fan, sort of speak.
I will tell you honestly that you could tripple that $1400.00 and I still wouldn't step foot into that hornets nest. If you get into the realm of $15K for the year, you'll have my services.
Fact is, some players simply need to grow up, and use their minds a bit. As LFC1,2,3 says, some days you need to suck it up and manage the official who'd walking on to the pitch. I say this full knowing our team is one of the worst for this.
We've had some very good refs this year, and some very poor ones. Take Phil...he's been very bad for a very long time. He's become a helluva lot worse with age (like most of us players, come to think of it), yet in the 15 odd years I can remember Phil being around, there have been very, very few new refs come into the league to replace him.
Carniehore: I feel your pain. But, when you make a statement like "Refs are there just to pick-up a paycheck", you lose all credibility. It tells me that you are young, and likely not in the workforce yet, and certainly not a proffessional in "Real" life like a lot of these guys are. Some may really need that income, some not...but I doubt it is worth it to show up "just for the cheque". I suppose if they do 4 games a week you're talking about an extra $800.00 / month. That doesn't have me or most guys scrambling to get into officiating.
Come to think of it, Whistleblower...why do you do this? I mean that honestly. So you get a bit of extra beer money (and I know it goes to beer...month of slimfast in order there big guy)...but there must be something else?
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When I first read that a player got a red for not shaking the ref's hand, I thought "man, that's just wrong!"
Then the real story came out.
The red was deserved. The player disrepected the official in a very public manner. TBH, the player should get more than one game for just being so fcuking stupid to pull off such a stunt.
All the other stuff being discussed out of that incident now in this thread is equally stupid. Utah asks a somewhat reasonable question but he's a bag of dicks anyways so valid discussion arising from it is moot.
Then the real story came out.
The red was deserved. The player disrepected the official in a very public manner. TBH, the player should get more than one game for just being so fcuking stupid to pull off such a stunt.
All the other stuff being discussed out of that incident now in this thread is equally stupid. Utah asks a somewhat reasonable question but he's a bag of dicks anyways so valid discussion arising from it is moot.
johnnybluenose
Well-Known Member
The real story came out ???
Where?
Where?
johnnybluenose
Well-Known Member
Huh, that kind of stuff is so bushleague...
Thanks.
Thanks.
I'll step into this debate and give my two bits worth on behalf of the referees. Personally I referee for the exercise and the love of being in the middle of a good game. Yes I train on my own, on a treadmill or bike, but at our level, there isn't a lot of organized training for referees. BC Soccer offers training for the "elite" referees that they have identified and are developing, but for the rest of us there's not much except a yearly fitness test.
I can only speak for myself, but the money isn't a real issue. By the time you get ready at home,drive to the game, ref, drive home and do your match reports and discipline, the pay is about $15 per hour. Not bad for a young kid, but if I wanted a side job I could make a lot more somewhere else.
On game days I prepare as a player would, I eat right, get some rest and sometimes have a few butterflies if I know it's a big game. I go on the FVSL website and look at the standings to see who is playing and what the game may mean. I was fortunate enough to play the game at a decent level 20-25 years ago, and it's fun being able to still be in the game at those levels. In a few years I may be like a lot of you players, too old to be at the top, so I work hard to stay there now.
As for finding new refs, it is a challenge to develop new ones. I'm the head referee with Pitt Meadows Youth. I put 25 kids through a beginner clinic in August and some of them have already packed it in due to the abuse they get from parents and coaches. Every year we lose more for various reasons to the point where we struggle to find referees for the U-17 and 18 age groups, so there aren't many new ones coming into the FVSL to take the place of the referees you all dislike. Maybe some of you old washed up players should think about joining us. Apparently the best referees are guys that have played the game.
I don't think any referee intentionally goes out to do a bad job. Some refs are better than others. Some handle abuse better than others. Some have an ability to manage the players better than others, but in the end, we just want to go out and be part of a good game, shake hands and go home. Imagine if we as referees could tell you how bad you are when you miss that sitter from 5 yards or tell a keeper how bad he is hen he lets in a bad goal. We can't, but yet you can give it to us when you think we've missed a call. I've never refereed a perfect game and I haven't seen too many players play a perfect game (at least in the FVSL). I see a few referees being called out on TTP, and at times it may be justified, but as players you need to look in the mirror. Are you a top player demanding a top referee, or a lower division hack who complains but can't play worth a sh*t. I've seen plenty of them in my years reffing. Martin has to schedule lots of games every week, and I'm pretty sure he tries to put the appropriate people in the appropriate spots. If he has a premier game at the same time as a Div.2 game, guess where the best referee is going. We're all doing our best, unfortunately that doesn't measure up to some of your standards. As I said earlier, come and join us in the middle.
Nigel
I can only speak for myself, but the money isn't a real issue. By the time you get ready at home,drive to the game, ref, drive home and do your match reports and discipline, the pay is about $15 per hour. Not bad for a young kid, but if I wanted a side job I could make a lot more somewhere else.
On game days I prepare as a player would, I eat right, get some rest and sometimes have a few butterflies if I know it's a big game. I go on the FVSL website and look at the standings to see who is playing and what the game may mean. I was fortunate enough to play the game at a decent level 20-25 years ago, and it's fun being able to still be in the game at those levels. In a few years I may be like a lot of you players, too old to be at the top, so I work hard to stay there now.
As for finding new refs, it is a challenge to develop new ones. I'm the head referee with Pitt Meadows Youth. I put 25 kids through a beginner clinic in August and some of them have already packed it in due to the abuse they get from parents and coaches. Every year we lose more for various reasons to the point where we struggle to find referees for the U-17 and 18 age groups, so there aren't many new ones coming into the FVSL to take the place of the referees you all dislike. Maybe some of you old washed up players should think about joining us. Apparently the best referees are guys that have played the game.
I don't think any referee intentionally goes out to do a bad job. Some refs are better than others. Some handle abuse better than others. Some have an ability to manage the players better than others, but in the end, we just want to go out and be part of a good game, shake hands and go home. Imagine if we as referees could tell you how bad you are when you miss that sitter from 5 yards or tell a keeper how bad he is hen he lets in a bad goal. We can't, but yet you can give it to us when you think we've missed a call. I've never refereed a perfect game and I haven't seen too many players play a perfect game (at least in the FVSL). I see a few referees being called out on TTP, and at times it may be justified, but as players you need to look in the mirror. Are you a top player demanding a top referee, or a lower division hack who complains but can't play worth a sh*t. I've seen plenty of them in my years reffing. Martin has to schedule lots of games every week, and I'm pretty sure he tries to put the appropriate people in the appropriate spots. If he has a premier game at the same time as a Div.2 game, guess where the best referee is going. We're all doing our best, unfortunately that doesn't measure up to some of your standards. As I said earlier, come and join us in the middle.
Nigel
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