BCSPL Rule - Substitutions

[Stuck in Bridge Traffic]

Long time lurker... some great banter here, many lol's reading your posts. Need some help and didn't know where to turn except here so it was time to set up an account.

I have been trying to research a rule I hear is going to be enforced at U16 (and maybe other ages) re substitutions. I've heard that if a player is substituted off in the half they cannot return to the field until the next half of play. This sounds similar to what Y league was/is doing.

All I could find was this bit off of BcSoccer.net.
http://www.bcsoccer.net/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=CrBZ-jD1Lo0=&tabid=186

RULE 24 - RULES OF PLAY - YOUTH

k) The allowable number of substitutions shall be at the discretion of the scheduling body and
approved by the Association.​

I don't believe Metro has ever had this rule at U15 and younger in past years. To me it speaks of an assumption that BCSPL is a one of the "big" leagues where similar rules exist. I feel it does nothing for player development other than to ensure they are physically fit. In particular I worry that now players will "play tough" and stay on the field when they are injured when the right thing to do is take them off and assess the injury.

Can someone confirm this rule exists for BCSPL?

How does it support player development?

 

[nocents]

I can't find the written rule anywhere, but I've been told multiple times that for U14 and up in BCSPL there is a 7 substitution maximum rule and once a player has been substituted off, he/she may not re-enter the game. I believe the break down is that 5 subs are allowed during the play and 2 are allowed during half time.

For U13 I believe it's unlimited subs, but a player cannot go back on within the half that he/she was subbed out.

The intent is to put pressure on the coaches to play their top players more, which in turn is supposed to pushed the players harder to crack the starting line-up.

This implementation is attempting to balance the pressure of elite soccer with player development. By setting the subs to 7 there are top spots to fight for and still if everyone on the team (assuming 18 players) is performing well then all can get some field time. I feel for the players & families shelling out $2500/yr. on those 20 person rosters; 2 players will always be benched.

I'm not completely sold, but it looks like someone put some thought into it. I do agree the injury aspect is not good, but if an exception was added would it be abused? What if all the subs are made and then a player is injured with 15 minutes left to play? I guess the team plays with 10 men or the player sucks it up, thus enforcing your point.

 

[Outwest]

"The intent is to put pressure on the coaches to play their top players more, which in turn is supposed to pushed the players harder to crack the starting line-up."

Hmm. Other perspectives do come to mind.....

Not sure how this will work when there's a long bench of players (and parents) that are in for $2500 and who get 10 minutes of mop-up at the end, or play 10 minutes at the start and are subbed off.

 

[bettermirror]

Ummm, Bridge Traffic....

The rule can alse be looked at this way. By having open substitutions matches are played at unrealistically quick pace from kickoff to the end of the match. Players never have to learn "match control", they never have to adapt their tempo and pace. They simply have to "work really hard until you are tired then we'll take you off." It's unrealistic and doesn't improve soccer intelligence....thus, limit the substitutions. But at u13 all the kids need to play a lot, probably u14 as well. So hopefully those ages have some exceptions.

Having the "if off in first half can't play until second half and if off at second half your game is done" rule is exactly the same as SYL.

As for Outwest's comments, you are right. There will almost always be issues with such a rule and having a large bench. Managing game time could prove problematic for the squads with 16+ players....I know it was tough for me with an 18 player squad this summer. Tough on a few of the players too....#notpleasedCoachorPlayer.

Nocents - interesting to hear your comments on the 7 subs rule. If by pushing the players harder to get a starting spot that may work for some kids. Other kids who are perreniel subs will just quit - parents unhappy, reputation of league can potentially drop. You'll find the "bench players" rotating on most teams every year at tryouts....hopefully teams don't take kids just to get to the magic 18....ideally just 16 are taken if only 16 are good enough. Sometimes tough to see that though at the typical 3 days of tryouts and are only found out over course of season.

I'd be interested to know what substitution rules are used in elite youth leagues in European or South American countries.

If the sub rule is "7 period" and a kid gets hurt that's that. You are down to 10. Coaches and players have to be honest. At a tournament this weekend a kid went on, he was hobbling visibly, could hardly turn. ....can't blame coaches totally if kids hide injuries....which they will do. My playing days weren't so long ago - I remember hiding injuries. (the kid was yanked despite saying he was "fine" and didn't return for the 2nd half of the final game - 4th game of tourney. Fortunately his dad is smart and understood why his kid didn't play again!)

 

[Captain Shamrock]

Bollocks to the limited substitution rules......it is a joke. Kids have to learn to 'manage' their game? Kids at that age should be able to go hard throughout a game and having them 'take it easy' for awhile to 'manage' their game is promoting laziness and nothing else........

At the end of the day, the coaches 'reputations' are on the line in this league as they are getting paid a subtantial amount of money. They will, at the end of the day, play their best players in order to win games because if they don't win, it doesn't look good on them. Forcing the coaches to limit their substitutions takes away from the possibility of trying players in different spots throughout a game. It's great practicing but it's in the games where we can assess how they are improving or not. Keeping on the bench or playing them 10 minutes isn't going to show anything to the coaches.......except where they are standing in the league.

Let them play.......let them play......

 

[Colin Elmes]

The most interesting part about this discussion is no one has come on here and cleared this all up! I personally havent looked at this new leagues playing standards/rules but I am sensing this information is not available( like a whole bunch about this league...) I was told recently that the Technical Operations Manual is still 60 days away. That puts us at the end of October, 2 weeks before the mini season ends and the league shuts down till March. Some help that will be. It all starts on the 17th. I hope you find your answer.

 

[parent]

FYI. As an HPL player parent, I have a PDF copy of said EA_BCSPL Technical Operations Manual.

 

[Regs]

Shhhh, you're not supposed to let Elmo know these things as BCSA plays mind games with him and the TSS group.

Read the fine print in the memos!

 

[mtkb]

Well, since Colin has baited the hook, and with the thesis that misinformation is worse than no information...

1) News to me if the technical manual is 60 days away. I would think it much closer than that...

2) What I can say, unequivocally, is that any copy of ANY league manual currently circulating is, at best, draft... views on secrecy / transparency aside, circulating drafts to the whole world is a great way for misinformation / gossip to start circulating and do far more harm than good...

 

[Captain Shamrock]

Parent, would you mind e-mailing that to me or even e-mailing your harddrive. Cheers.

 

[nocents]

Colin forgot one critical thing during the HPL application process: The handshake

Next time perhaps?

If only there was someone involved with BCSA or any of the BCSPL teams willing to come forth and clear up what should be a simple question. My response was based on explanations provided to me by coaches from two different BCSPL clubs.

 

[Colin Elmes]

FYI. As an HPL player parent, I have a PDF copy of said EA_BCSPL Technical Operations Manual.

ah yes Parent. Thank you. I now see that the link on the EA BCSPL website is live now. I guess they forgot to let me know.....

Some reading for today. Good stuff.

 

[parent]

EA BC Soccer Premier League

 

[Colin Elmes]

Colin forgot one critical thing during the HPL application process: The handshake

Next time perhaps?

If only there was someone involved with BCSA or any of the BCSPL teams willing to come forth and clear up what should be a simple question. My response was based on explanations provided to me by coaches from two different BCSPL clubs.

Thats funny. If you had been in our HPL Feedback session with BCSA you would know I tried all of those approaches.

 

[Colin Elmes]

Shhhh, you're not supposed to let Elmo know these things as BCSA plays mind games with him and the TSS group.

Read the fine print in the memos!

Mind Games would suggest superior intelligence. Examples please

 

[Regs]

Example asked for, example given: The BCSA doesn't post on TTP.

 

[Colin Elmes]

Example asked for, example given: The BCSA doesn't post on TTP.

That would suggest that your intelligence has been in question since June 2001 and I have just gotten stupid in August

 

[Regs]

Come on Elmo, my intelligence has never been in question... it's not high.

 

[Colin Elmes]

Come on Elmo, my intelligence has never been in question... it's not high.

Well, I feel at home then

 

[What' all this then?]

Anyone know how much $$ BC soccer is using of our money to "support" this new league?
I wonder how much the leagues would think if they got the same amount of support?

The technical manual looks like Marcus was busy for a while. Then three times a year they will have data on about 1800 players to digest.

Sorry, but the vast majority of players should not be paying for this elite service. Shouldn't the clubs pay for this? (albeit the players parents).
Nothing in BC Soccer's budget was passed to support this amount of involvement.