TSS commencing an action against the BCSA

dezza

Well-Known Member
Est
Feb 20, 2005
Messages
3,051
Reaction score
1,444
Location
Vancouver
Tokens
2,494
Dirty Money
420
But then why are so many more Ontario kids getting those opportunities?

Vaughan Azzurri had 4 of their graduates move to NCAA and then get picked in this years MLS draft. That's just one club and one draft year!

Sigma academy produced Larin, Laryea, etc
 
Last edited:

Dude

Lifetime Better Bastard
Est
Jul 23, 2001
Messages
15,034
Reaction score
3,571
Location
Where my kids are
Tokens
7,796
Dirty Money
100
I was only referencing BC kids. You tell me, I suspect the answer lies in development, ease of access and identification, and possibly our lack of a Tier 3 league? My best guess is it's a case of the same old Ontario advantage: more numbers, closer to the East, natural selection. The bulk of schools lie in the Midwest and East. If you are the coach from a Midwest or Eastern based university, and you have limited time to scout, where would you go? If Canada is on your list, you will look at the top Provinces for registrations, as well as successes in Professional / National development. Ontario comes up first, Quebec second, and I believe BC a distant third- at least for registrations. I don't know the numbers for National team placement, but we may even be fourth behind Alberta. If you know the numbers, you tell me.

BC is way behind the 8 ball. We are behind in getting a Regional Tier 3 league going, and while we used to stand out from the crowd (again, 20 ish years ago), we no longer do. The only possible argument someone may be able to make is that BC has more professional teams than Quebec, but I bet by next year that won't be the case.

Am I close?
 

mtkb

Well-Known Member
Est
Feb 1, 2011
Messages
820
Reaction score
379
Location
Burnaby
Tokens
669
Dirty Money
100
No @Dude, more players from bc are not heading south on scholarships, at least on the men's side.

That's the point of asking that question. If you are in whitecaps residency you are practically guaranteed one, but if you are in bcspl you are chopped liver.

Once it becomes clear you won't make Caps there is literally no point staying in bcspl.
that's a little harsh... it's still the next best level, and some of these players are perfectly happy graduating out and then playing in the VMSL while they work through school, job, marriage, kids... life.

To Dude's point, I like the idea of mandating that coaches recommend players to be promoted / demoted each year, but you can't force it. That starts to look a lot like "shut up, we know what's best for you, so fcuking do it"... let's be honest, for all the focus we put on high level soccer and none on cradle to grave, the men's team is usually around 100 out of about 200, and the women aren't that much better... I don't think anyone is in a position to start barking orders at parents...
 

dezza

Well-Known Member
Est
Feb 20, 2005
Messages
3,051
Reaction score
1,444
Location
Vancouver
Tokens
2,494
Dirty Money
420
that's a little harsh... it's still the next best level, and some of these players are perfectly happy graduating out and then playing in the VMSL while they work through school, job, marriage, kids... life.
Sure, some of the players may be happy with that, but are their parents who are forking out an extra $2k/year over what metro costs?

Maybe they don't care either because they seem happy enough to shuttle little Johnny to and from soccer in their tesla/bmw/mercedes.

Maybe that's the real issue here... BC players these days are soft. We should make them take vancouver taxis to soccer to harden them up. That's real adversity!
 
  • Like
Reactions: ThiKu

Dude

Lifetime Better Bastard
Est
Jul 23, 2001
Messages
15,034
Reaction score
3,571
Location
Where my kids are
Tokens
7,796
Dirty Money
100
Sure, some of the players may be happy with that, but are their parents who are forking out an extra $2k/year over what metro costs?

Maybe they don't care either because they seem happy enough to shuttle little Johnny to and from soccer in their tesla/bmw/mercedes.

Maybe that's the real issue here... BC players these days are soft. We should make them take vancouver taxis to soccer to harden them up. That's real adversity!
Love this, and can't agree more. It goes back to my jihad on the BCPL costing structure: football is supposed to be the most affordable game in the world. Shin pads, boots, and someone please bring a ball. The single biggest problem with the advent of the BCPL was it's pay-to-play model in the beginning. It's very simple, as you escalate those costs, you eliminate many, many families who chose other endeavors for their kids. let's face it, soccer isn't exactly paying off, professionally speaking. If I had a talented kid in a bunch of sports, and got to the age where we had to choose investing time and money for return, I'd pick baseball, not soccer. For some reason out here in BC, we ARE standing out from the crowd. Canada, and in particular BC, is doing something right.

Look at Captain Shamrock's comments in page 1 of this.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mtkb and ThiKu

Dude

Lifetime Better Bastard
Est
Jul 23, 2001
Messages
15,034
Reaction score
3,571
Location
Where my kids are
Tokens
7,796
Dirty Money
100
Just to sort of check on my assumptions, one of my employees is heavily involved in baseball in Langley.

To give an example, the Blaze, if you make the squad, have 100% placement of kids into US Universities. 100%!

There are 14 or so BC Premier Baseball teams (grades 11&12 I think), and not all have those numbers, but most have very positive placement numbers.

In the case of the Blaze, I’m told:
  • 100% placement to scholarship universities.
  • Ownership is actually employed by Milwaukee Brewers.
  • Every year all or most BCP teams go down to several showcases in the US.
  • Costs is about $4500 per year, and that includes all “in season”, all winter training, all spring training. Travel extra.
  • Kids that get selected to the National program get a ~$10K bonus cheque.
  • Kids from all over the country try-out of the Blaze; he figures about 60% on the team are made up of BC born players.

He explains the big thing is the connections. In this case, it’d be like a top level German or EPL team having ownership stakes in the BCPL club, and facilitating the connections to showcase the kids in front of actual scouts.

Baseball has the obvious geographical advantage; the best baseball league on the planet and best post secondary development system is directly South of us, not overseas. However, Baseball development in BC is definitely “standing out from the crowd”; from the rest of Canada, and it’s certainly on the Map in the US. The Blaze, doing what they have, have put a spotlight on the rest of these BC Teams.

I find it to be a pretty interesting comparison.

The cost is comparable, but if the kid is on the Blaze, and he keeps his grades up, he will win a scholarship, at least. Maybe he’ll be drafted. That’s immediate payback.
 

Rangerforever

Better Bastard
Est
Sep 5, 2001
Messages
6,620
Reaction score
1,413
Location
Govan
Tokens
3,832
Dirty Money
60
I challenge anyone who has a kid who makes an BCSPL team say no to him or her.
In general, you will do it and you will pay for it.

I personally have never once seen a kid turn it down because his/her parents couldn't afford it.
I'm sure it happens but never once have I seen a kid in a lower level team who should be playing in the HPL.

All other points here have merit but do not tell me you're going to say no to your kid when its their dream to play at the highest level locally, regardless of post secondary or professional ambitions.

And players in the BCSPL do go on to scholarships.
Maybe not NCAA Div 1, agreed on that as I recall a lot of those schools wouldn't even begin discussions with my kid unless he was in the Whitecaps or Canadian National program.
And no matter how good, there will always be a bias to take the American kid over the Canadian kid.
Happens in Europe too.
But loads of Div 2/3/NAIA and Canadian schools definitely consider BCSPL players.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mtkb and knvb

dezza

Well-Known Member
Est
Feb 20, 2005
Messages
3,051
Reaction score
1,444
Location
Vancouver
Tokens
2,494
Dirty Money
420
@Rangerforever I can show you a whole team of kids who spurned BCSPL to stay in metro...

2001 Port Moody AC Selects Metro. I believe they even entered the "Premier" Provincial cup competition and beat a couple BCSPL teams.

2 of them were selected to SFU straight out of youth, and a 3rd will join them in the fall
 

Dude

Lifetime Better Bastard
Est
Jul 23, 2001
Messages
15,034
Reaction score
3,571
Location
Where my kids are
Tokens
7,796
Dirty Money
100
"I personally have never once seen a kid turn it down because his/her parents couldn't afford it.
I'm sure it happens but never once have I seen a kid in a lower level team who should be playing in the HPL."

What clubs were you involved in (he says knowing the answer). I kid but I don't, I do not count the 1% ers within the Langley / Coquitlam / Coastal catchment as the segment being nickle and dimed out. Talk to me if you are an immigrant family from Central Surrey. The point is, you don't even bother chasing the dream of playing BCPL if your mom and dad can't even get you into academy, where almost all the selection takes place young. They are blocked out from the beginning, paving the way for well-to-do kids. Good for them, less competition from an early age. That always breeds better players, I hear.

And yeah, I'd have found a way. FFS, my kid chose road racing. Want to talk about expensive? After his Junior year done, focus shifted from Cycling to beer drinking 101. I'd do it again, sports and competition are great for kids, but the discussion is, what the fcuk was the point of it if Metro already had it figured out, and it sure seems like more cash grab than development, from the cheap seats.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ThiKu

Rangerforever

Better Bastard
Est
Sep 5, 2001
Messages
6,620
Reaction score
1,413
Location
Govan
Tokens
3,832
Dirty Money
60
I'm not denying Metro already had it figured out.
Asshat. :)

I get the money thing - Look at hockey today for elite players compared to what we were paying for our two boys to play House.
I couldn't believe the cost and time commitments.
I was glad he didn't want to play rep lol.
But I would have paid it for my kid if he wanted it.

Fair play Dezza.
I'm just saying being a parent of a past HPL player and also a past executive in two youth clubs, one in Newton by the way, Asshat, (Meant for Dude), that I have personally never seen a kid play below his or her level unless he/she wanted it that way.
Parents, Clubs who are compassionate, along with organizations like KidSport and A4K simply make it happen.
'In general'.
 

bandcamp

Well-Known Member
Est
Jul 20, 2001
Messages
1,806
Reaction score
654
Location
copasetic state
Tokens
1,593
Dirty Money
100
I agree with @Rangerforever. I haven’t seen players play down if they’re of the ability. I’m sure each club is different but on Fusion I believe there is cost relief through their sponsor, Windset Farms for those that can‘t afford the fees.

I am concerned about the watering down of the league though as we have a 50% increase in teams. For Fusion, they pull from all 6 Vancouver youth clubs plus all of Richmond. Now that VUFC and TSS have their own teams I imagine that Fusion is going to have a very hard time attracting players...not to mention you’re going from one to three teams in the same catchment. The quality has to go down.
 

dezza

Well-Known Member
Est
Feb 20, 2005
Messages
3,051
Reaction score
1,444
Location
Vancouver
Tokens
2,494
Dirty Money
420
I am concerned about the watering down of the league though as we have a 50% increase in teams. For Fusion, they pull from all 6 Vancouver youth clubs plus all of Richmond. Now that VUFC and TSS have their own teams I imagine that Fusion is going to have a very hard time attracting players...not to mention you’re going from one to three teams in the same catchment. The quality has to go down.
It's even worse than that when you factor in that VI Wave & TOFC are completely different markets. You're actually increasing the lower mainland teams from 6 to 10 (66% increase) without increasing the available player pool.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ThiKu and bandcamp

Ronaldo. 07

Active Member
Est
Oct 7, 2019
Messages
371
Reaction score
49
Tokens
520
Dirty Money
0
These 4 clubs should not be getting bcspl. Langley teams in every age are pretty bad. TSS doesn't even have enough players to field teams for all ages. North van teams for youth are mostly dogshit. And vusc doesn't even have a metro program so the fact they have bcspl now is beyond me. West van produces top teams and they should have bcspl. Ccb is the biggest youth club in bc and has the most players playing for it. Most of the players that play for surrey united and coastal are out of the Newton area. Port Moody also deserves hpl as they have some very good teams as well.
 

Ronaldo. 07

Active Member
Est
Oct 7, 2019
Messages
371
Reaction score
49
Tokens
520
Dirty Money
0
@Rangerforever I can show you a whole team of kids who spurned BCSPL to stay in metro...

2001 Port Moody AC Selects Metro. I believe they even entered the "Premier" Provincial cup competition and beat a couple BCSPL teams.

2 of them were selected to SFU straight out of youth, and a 3rd will join them in the fall
Correct this team beat every hpl team except metroford. All 17 of their players were good enough for hpl. 2 of them recently had trials in Europe one with west ham united youth. the one mistake they made is that when they challenged hpl 2 of their top players left and went to hpl. Had they stayed u wudve had a metro team representing bc at nationals.
 

knvb

Better Bastard
Est
Aug 17, 2001
Messages
12,002
Reaction score
955
Location
My Office
Tokens
1,533
Dirty Money
0
It'll be interesting to see the impending fights and complaints start flying in the valley when LUSA, Fraser Valley, Surrey United and CFC start fighting over the same now smaller pool of 'top' players. It's already cut throat. I wonder which club will think outside the box to attract and keep the players because other than a few hundred bucks here or there, they're the same and there is no loyalty. Zero. Little Dude at Langley sits on the bench for 10 mins longer than the next kid he's off to save the next closest club in a heart beat.

My kid is in the last year of it, and it was seriously, I'm looking for the right word, disheartening maybe? watching parents anxiety and rage sore at the start of every phase, scrambling furiously from club to club to be included or better positioned.

They're literally all swapping disgruntled players and coaches as it is. I wonder if they'll bring back boundaries?
 

Staff online

Members online

Top