I was just wondering why the vmsl and fvsl dont start their leagues during spring break time, early march because it doesnt rain as much after that and therefore games wouldnt be cancelled as often. I dont know if this idea has already been proposed and turned down but i would definetly think its a good idea. It would be great to hear everyones opinion on this. Cheers
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Fields.
That's the main issue that is always brought up - spring/summer is for softball & baseball (
)
That being said, at the rate we are going, it is going to be hard to use this arguement in the future because I can't remember the last time I saw a new turf field complex with an infield.
Scrap the CAT system and move just premier in both leagues to summer.
That's the main issue that is always brought up - spring/summer is for softball & baseball (
)That being said, at the rate we are going, it is going to be hard to use this arguement in the future because I can't remember the last time I saw a new turf field complex with an infield.
Scrap the CAT system and move just premier in both leagues to summer.
canucklehead
Member
Regs said:
Here's one for you, Regs...When the Richmond soccer groups was trying to get the City of Richmond to build the AT's at Boyd and 2 at South Arm, the problem that they (city) had with South Arm was that it is home to some basball/fastball club. Where an AT field was to be placed, it would (un)fortunatly displace a ball dimond. And there was no way that they wanted to rock the boat with those users. So, they (city) prposed that the AT form the outfield of the ball dimond. The plans that were drawn up looked rediculous. Possibly the stupidest idea put out there at the time of these negotiations. In the end, the next AT to be built (target 2008)will most likly go in at King George Park because of the lack of realistic options at South Arm.
Who cares about the FVSL & VMSL. Get Metro U-18 and everything else under that down to U-6 playing March through July. Kids need to play, instead of having the grass pitches shut down two weeks running like Surrey has done to ADDFC.
Kids need the PT, plus they need to be outside...not stuck training in a gym.
As pointed out, the turf pitches give soccer way more options, and with more light available in the summer, this is a no-brainer. Besides, every other Province, plus anywhere outside the Island and Lower Mainland in BC, makes the field availability work for all users. Why can't we?
As for us adults, it would clear availability for us to have more fields on Saturdays during fall / winter / early spring.
But, hey...that all makes too much sense.
Kids need the PT, plus they need to be outside...not stuck training in a gym.
As pointed out, the turf pitches give soccer way more options, and with more light available in the summer, this is a no-brainer. Besides, every other Province, plus anywhere outside the Island and Lower Mainland in BC, makes the field availability work for all users. Why can't we?
As for us adults, it would clear availability for us to have more fields on Saturdays during fall / winter / early spring.
But, hey...that all makes too much sense.
I know about five years ago, there was a big push by Willy and others to switch the Vmsl and the U18 to a spring/summer league with lower age groups to follow in subsequent years.
I think the league even had a meeting about it if I remember correctly. I know Willy had meetings with the parks board people from various municipalities to discuss the change. Obviously the big issue was that baseball/softball played in those months and it would be hard to make the change. I know they pressed hard for quite a while to make this a reality but in the end, soccer got fcuked around again.
I say switch soccer and baseball/softball/slow pitch and let the pajama wearing slugs play in the pissing rain. It may be ugly if played in the rain, but really, how can you make baseball much uglier than it already is......th rest of the country does, why can't we.
I think the league even had a meeting about it if I remember correctly. I know Willy had meetings with the parks board people from various municipalities to discuss the change. Obviously the big issue was that baseball/softball played in those months and it would be hard to make the change. I know they pressed hard for quite a while to make this a reality but in the end, soccer got fcuked around again.
I say switch soccer and baseball/softball/slow pitch and let the pajama wearing slugs play in the pissing rain. It may be ugly if played in the rain, but really, how can you make baseball much uglier than it already is......th rest of the country does, why can't we.
FRANCIS said:
Not to mention that the rest of Canada plays during summer and that BC teams are at a major handicap when competing at Nationals several months after their season ended. My U-14 team finished fourth at Nationals this year and were easily the team that should have/could have won the damn thing. Fact is we finished Coastal Cup in April, played Provincials in July and Nationals in October. Talk about trying to keep a team a team! If we played in July, nobody and I mean nobody would have been able to compete against us. Everyone was peaking and maximized.
Same goes for our senior teams.
Meanwhile, we can allow these tubsters that call themselves athletes play slow-pitch and jiggle their beer guts around our parks.
Crap.
Nope, none of the Richmond Soccer Alliance proposals lead by RGSA & RYSA had any incorporaton of diamond users in the AT's. City & RSA Proposal ask to have diamond users moved to other sites that soccer was willing to give up or reconfigure. Concept was to complex not only soccer but baseball much like softball is at London & McNair. Blundell was the best example w/ new sand celled going E & W w/ a diamond in the NE corner where the infield is nowhere near the pitch. Rmd West Baseball was the only club not to deal w/ the City & they got pushed to Steves where they will have to deal w/ clay base until the next phase of sand celled
South Arm (SA) 1 was the only field considered due to size & visibility for security & lighting reasons. Rugby will need to be relocated & they will probably come out winners w/ a new sand celled rugby specific field. SA 3 & 4 are already sand celled so no need to replace as city is getting fees on all sand celled fields starting in Jan 2007. SA 2 would be a good choice as it's clay based but lighting could be issued.
IMO the City & RSA have learnt that it's best to build in the summer, avoid 100% school land & most importantly to build complexes of 2 or more fields as it lower costs. If I was a beating person it will be SA for 2 fields in 2008 as having 2 soccer complexes is cost effective.
As to youth leagues they comes first in the City then gender. All you have to do is look at the size of youth leagues in the Coastal Area & they make up 80% of the users. Using girls soccer as an example how can you compare 660 youth teams to MWSL's 125 teams.
The RSA proposal is the key to getting better fields for soccer. Yes, it's a investment, annual user fees & rental for AT along w/ sand celled but bottomline is 60% more use for all field users.....off course soccer comes first as the biggest investor & user.
Hopefully Vancouver will wake up & do something as they are so far behind the rest of BC for AT's!!!!
South Arm (SA) 1 was the only field considered due to size & visibility for security & lighting reasons. Rugby will need to be relocated & they will probably come out winners w/ a new sand celled rugby specific field. SA 3 & 4 are already sand celled so no need to replace as city is getting fees on all sand celled fields starting in Jan 2007. SA 2 would be a good choice as it's clay based but lighting could be issued.
IMO the City & RSA have learnt that it's best to build in the summer, avoid 100% school land & most importantly to build complexes of 2 or more fields as it lower costs. If I was a beating person it will be SA for 2 fields in 2008 as having 2 soccer complexes is cost effective.
As to youth leagues they comes first in the City then gender. All you have to do is look at the size of youth leagues in the Coastal Area & they make up 80% of the users. Using girls soccer as an example how can you compare 660 youth teams to MWSL's 125 teams.
The RSA proposal is the key to getting better fields for soccer. Yes, it's a investment, annual user fees & rental for AT along w/ sand celled but bottomline is 60% more use for all field users.....off course soccer comes first as the biggest investor & user.
Hopefully Vancouver will wake up & do something as they are so far behind the rest of BC for AT's!!!!
Fields is a major issue for all soccer levels to shift over to spring-fall play rather than fall-spring as it is now.
Although I no longer coach (driven out bythe useless CAT system and the need for players to live at or near the park you want to play at), it seems to me that it would make sense to commence planning for a shift in seasons for the major leagues like the VMSL and FVSL at minimum.
Many teams do nothing in the summer but over the years we always kept teams I had together and played in a summer league from the last week of April through to mid-July or longer. Players like to play in summer as the games are guaranteed to be on and the weather is always better.
As I look back now, I realize it is idiotic to play 18 games and cup play over some 7 months and some years some teams don't finish the league due to park closures. For guys who love to get out of the house twice a week over the winter, the training sessions are great but the training sessions to games ratio is completely nuts now and there is no commensurate improvement in soccer quality.
Others noting that the National competitions timing in Octobers hurts BC teams are also right on, but then again so are the VMSL sub rules inconsistent with national competition rules so VMSL teams get a dual disadvantage at National events. The sub rule is correctable to allow 5 subs during stoppage of play and unlimited at the half where they don't count. Limit the team roster for the games at 18 and this rule makes great sense as it now takes away one disadvantage for any VMSL teams like Sapperton and Firefighters had in this year's Nationals (or were they last years?). There was one game at the Nationals where I saw Sap take out a guy at the half and then he had to come back on 5 min later due to an injury right after the break. That was just one sub under National Rules but under VMSL rules that would have been 2.
I think the first step would have to be planning what it would take to shift to a Spring start schedule and this has is not the simplest of tasks as it would need to involve the Cities of the region in which VMSL games are played. I think it has to start with the feasibility from the parks perspective as you will never get clubs onside if you work from that level up.
The only precedent now for the spring schedule is the PCSL which years ago was a fall start just like the rest.
I think at the time they were talking about the shift in the season was at the height of softball where every park had games on them. Today, I don't see that same level of softball play like it was back then.
Although I no longer coach (driven out bythe useless CAT system and the need for players to live at or near the park you want to play at), it seems to me that it would make sense to commence planning for a shift in seasons for the major leagues like the VMSL and FVSL at minimum.
Many teams do nothing in the summer but over the years we always kept teams I had together and played in a summer league from the last week of April through to mid-July or longer. Players like to play in summer as the games are guaranteed to be on and the weather is always better.
As I look back now, I realize it is idiotic to play 18 games and cup play over some 7 months and some years some teams don't finish the league due to park closures. For guys who love to get out of the house twice a week over the winter, the training sessions are great but the training sessions to games ratio is completely nuts now and there is no commensurate improvement in soccer quality.
Others noting that the National competitions timing in Octobers hurts BC teams are also right on, but then again so are the VMSL sub rules inconsistent with national competition rules so VMSL teams get a dual disadvantage at National events. The sub rule is correctable to allow 5 subs during stoppage of play and unlimited at the half where they don't count. Limit the team roster for the games at 18 and this rule makes great sense as it now takes away one disadvantage for any VMSL teams like Sapperton and Firefighters had in this year's Nationals (or were they last years?). There was one game at the Nationals where I saw Sap take out a guy at the half and then he had to come back on 5 min later due to an injury right after the break. That was just one sub under National Rules but under VMSL rules that would have been 2.
I think the first step would have to be planning what it would take to shift to a Spring start schedule and this has is not the simplest of tasks as it would need to involve the Cities of the region in which VMSL games are played. I think it has to start with the feasibility from the parks perspective as you will never get clubs onside if you work from that level up.
The only precedent now for the spring schedule is the PCSL which years ago was a fall start just like the rest.
I think at the time they were talking about the shift in the season was at the height of softball where every park had games on them. Today, I don't see that same level of softball play like it was back then.
crnogorski fudbaler
Member
The story i heard was the italians wanted the league to go spring/summer.The other side of this coin was the irish,english and scotts wanted it to be as we now see it today.They wanted to play soccer/fudbal when the league started back in there native countries.Hence the reason why we play at the same times they do.But then again thats just what i heard a while back when i was coaching.and when i was with the select program.........
Start the U-18 and U-16 programs in the spring/summer(march) with a short break in August. Resume late August, wrap up the season in October. Continue this format for the rest of the youth divisions as BC Soccer figures out parks and scheduling. ie, stop building those freakin turf fields and put real grass on them.
Who cares about the hacks in the senior divisions, they could play on gravel in the middle of monsoon season for all I care.
Who cares about the hacks in the senior divisions, they could play on gravel in the middle of monsoon season for all I care.
U16 - 18 for spring & summer. ....not. What about school soccer & the other sports the kids play
right up to Sep. Don't forget that families want to go on vacations too!!!
Youth soccer does & has always followed the official BC school calendar otherwise it would be impossible to schedule 660 teams in 5 District. NOTE that 5 D is the largest District Youth League in BC so I doubt that they are going to change. Yep, they are 2x the size of any boys league.
Grass fields unless sand celled are history due to the high cost of building & maintainence. RSA plan is to keep the best sand celled & get some new ones for the important games now that they don't get practiced on as much. Outside of that the plan is 2 new AT every other year or sooner as there is 60% more useage compared to grass ie 3 game on grass when you can schedule AT's from 8am to 630 in 5D
On scheduling BCSA has nothing to do w/ it. All youth leagues do their own schedules. Hence, Districts have to do their own thing to get better fields. The only time BCSA get involved is for A & B cups draws onwards. Outside of that the youth leagues do everything w/ BCSA taking the majority of the player fees. Most Districts & Youth leagues see very litttle of the $26 bucks that goes to BCSA.
For the future AT is the only way to go w/ the high costs of grass. Until Youth Distircts develop their own AT proposals for the Cities all soccer will suffer. Youth is the biggest voice, the emotional connection to the voters & councilors of the Cities & that's the only way it's going to get started. Add the support of Senior soccer & the voice gets bigger so no sport save mabye that Ultimate game in Van can challenge soccer. Cities can't afford things so those user groups that can invest, pay annual user fees & rental fees are going to run the show
right up to Sep. Don't forget that families want to go on vacations too!!!
Youth soccer does & has always followed the official BC school calendar otherwise it would be impossible to schedule 660 teams in 5 District. NOTE that 5 D is the largest District Youth League in BC so I doubt that they are going to change. Yep, they are 2x the size of any boys league.
Grass fields unless sand celled are history due to the high cost of building & maintainence. RSA plan is to keep the best sand celled & get some new ones for the important games now that they don't get practiced on as much. Outside of that the plan is 2 new AT every other year or sooner as there is 60% more useage compared to grass ie 3 game on grass when you can schedule AT's from 8am to 630 in 5D
On scheduling BCSA has nothing to do w/ it. All youth leagues do their own schedules. Hence, Districts have to do their own thing to get better fields. The only time BCSA get involved is for A & B cups draws onwards. Outside of that the youth leagues do everything w/ BCSA taking the majority of the player fees. Most Districts & Youth leagues see very litttle of the $26 bucks that goes to BCSA.
For the future AT is the only way to go w/ the high costs of grass. Until Youth Distircts develop their own AT proposals for the Cities all soccer will suffer. Youth is the biggest voice, the emotional connection to the voters & councilors of the Cities & that's the only way it's going to get started. Add the support of Senior soccer & the voice gets bigger so no sport save mabye that Ultimate game in Van can challenge soccer. Cities can't afford things so those user groups that can invest, pay annual user fees & rental fees are going to run the show
