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Regional Tier 3 League

Regs

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Did anyone here go to the AGM stuff over the weekend?

What was the news, if anything, regarding this topic?

Cheers,

Regs.
 

Canucks4Ever

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I really love this idea because I believe it's a step we need in order to become competitive on a global level.

That being said I think the biggest challenges facing this type of league are population density, climate and a development pathway for players.

For example Australia has a great model and it actually looks similar to Canada's current amateur setup (with essentially Provincially based league ultimately competing for a national title), but the difference is the way their population is clustered. While their overall population is smaller than Canada's, both Melbourne and Sydney have populations of over 4 million people and are only 2 hours apart by plane (8 by car). With that many people there are bound to be enough sponsors, players and fans to draw from. In comparison the GVRD, Edmonton and Calgary collectively only have a population of 4.5 million people. The GTA has a population of 6 million and Montreal 4 million, but here is where the climate affects things, given that the season would be only 4-5 months which is tough to carve out a living in. Obviously it's semi-professional, but the reality is that the time commitment for those months would make it difficult to hold down other employment.

Junior hockey has a good model, average CHL attendance is 7000. Remember though that there is limited competition for entertainment dollars a majority of these markets. As well players are not paid. It is a 16-20 year old development league, essentially the apex of the funnel of all of minor hockey. This development path is something that soccer does not have (due to the lack of playing opportunities/leageue - its a vicious cycle...). So if players do not make the NHL (ie the majority) they are able to return to the career force at a young age or continue to pursue their professional dreams in lower leagues.

I think this is soccer's biggest grass roots problem in Canada. The program does not change from 16-18, then suddenly it all falls under the umbrella of "adult soccer". Kids are left with no direction. Sure a few are identified by the Whitecaps and National program, but that is far too few. Suddenly the highest performance league is the College/University level, where you have to obviously be a student, not a "professional" or playing men's/women's football with established players in amateur leagues.

That's where I would start personally. A regional high performance 16-20 year old league with unpaid players and a regional focus. Think Junior B hockey (BCHL) rather than Junior A (CHL). 3 or 4 teams in the GVRD, plus PG, Kamloops, Kelowna, Cranbrook the Island (maybe 2 in the Victoria area and one in Nanaimo). Players are boarded in the community (like hockey) and return home in the off season. Small budgets and crowds (a few hundred maybe) and build from there. Local community sponsors and broadcast on the internet if so inclined with a big National Championship at the end of the season.

I get that USL is sort of that market (U23). More so however, this would really torpedo the college market. That being said with UBC having but its athletics in review recently and Kwantlen torpedoing their program perhaps this is the way the sport should go.

Anyway food for thought.
 

Regs

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Thanks DJ!

I'm not too sure the "C-League" and the topic of this thread are linked though. Great that Vancouver will potential have another pro team with an average salary of $40-$60K but it isn't regional for BC. And surely BC Soccer wouldn't need to form a committee to study if the Province can support another Pro team :)
 

Tedward

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Yeah two different topics being mixed up here.

1. C-League is Duane Rollins code-name for a D2 league he claims is in the works possible backed by CSA and CFL types.

2. BC D3 is an idea apparently being spoken about in dark corners by unnamed parties that would create something new in BC similar to (and possible eventually connected with) League One Ontario and the Quebec league.
 

Regs

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I've heard the idea being floated that this tier 3 league would be U23

Anyone in favor?

For me, I have to ask what's the point - so we can delay the issue of U21 league participants dispersing another 2 years?
 

bulljive

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I don't see how any of this really is beneficial. Unless the plan is to completely reprogram the Canadian development system from the top down throwing a tier 3 league or u23 league is useless. Honestly if you are Canadian and unattached at 24 are you really carving out a career?
 

Tedward

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Not really sure it makes a difference so long as they allow a certain number of O23 players. This is how the PDL is structured and the MLS reserve teams in USL are basically U23 with a few older first-teamers recovering/unavailable/unused on a temporary basis.
 

Dude

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Look at it this way, Regs...the concept should be development, and at what age do we really stop developing? Yes, one can ague that through experience, a player improves later in their career, but by 23 you know if they have it or not.

The emphasis has to be on developing, and selling / moving them up, or retiring them to the VMSL or FVSL.

By two bits.
 

Regs

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Right but in my opinion, development isn't the missing piece, it's the identification process. Putting another league/layer in there isn't going to fcuking matter if the same nimrods in place now are calling the shots on national team selections.

Or something like that.
 

Dude

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You are probably right, but...

One big problem w/ the identification process is that there isn't a domestic pro league in which to move the more talented players on to. For the most part they hit a barrier at age 18. There needs to be a better showcase where they are playing in a professional environment.
 

dezza

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And the Canadian Championship (Voyageurs Cup) needs to be open to more teams.

Check out the story of Kwadwo Poku who is now outperforming the likes of Fat Frank for NYCFC. Two years ago he was playing in the 4th tier NPSL, but got spotted by Eric Wynalda when his team played the Atlanta Silverbacks in NASL. 1 year impressing with them, and he's on to MLS. Next up, Europe?
 

Mr Base

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Dezza with so many teams in VMS,FVSL BMSA,NSSA. Soccer is watered down, is not good enough to go for Voyaguers CUP. If we head a BC Mainland League to get the Valley and Vancouver as one League I would see no problem. Start in march finish in November. Kids soccer is the same. HPL controls witch kids they let in. And the word which kids they let in . By far not the best players.
For most kids do not get even a chance. Only kids that buy the spot are in. That's where soccer is at here. BC soccer keeps on giving tickets out to coaches that never played the game just to get the fee. Seniors are all split up in to nations clubs they do not care about Voyaguer cup as long as the play and have fun.
The hole system has to change in realaty for soccer to grow here. You can see it in MLS no one from here makes it. And if they do sitting on the bench is where they be.
 

dezza

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Apparently, PDL is coming back to the lower mainland. Any idea who's behind this ? I think I know who but I don't wanna spill their beans.

https://goalwashington.wordpress.co...hts-reportedly-sold-to-group-in-vancouver-bc/

I had hoped that CMFSC would be taking this step but it's not happening this year.

Last I heard the PDL franchise fee was $75K. Assuming you can buy the rights to one like this at a cut-price rate (say $0.33 on the dollar). It's still a 25K investment before you even factor in operating expenses... CMFSC has that kind of money to spend for the benefit of a very small portion of their membership?
 

djones

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Last I heard the PDL franchise fee was $75K. Assuming you can buy the rights to one like this at a cut-price rate (say $0.33 on the dollar). It's still a 25K investment before you even factor in operating expenses... CMFSC has that kind of money to spend for the benefit of a very small portion of their membership?
Here's the thing...if the club wants to take the next step, this seems like it would be the logical although expensive one.

Having places for our bubbling golden generation to continue to develop from the ages 17-23 is a challenge. The VMSL is fine but I don't think it sets us apart, especially compared to other ambitious, progressive teams/clubs in the country.

Clubs like Calgary Foothills FC, the Ontario League 1 teams and the elite league in Quebec have surpassing clubs in BC and are now being looked upon as being the elite clubs outside the fully professional clubs for development. Are they doing anything better than what we are doing in BC? No but they give off the impression that they are because they are exposing their players to a more elite level. If we want to be the equals of these clubs, like clubs like CMF and SU etc... do, BC teams need to have something better than the PCSL to aim for which is a shadow of itself back in the 80's and early '90's. As I don't speak for the club, In my opinion, the PDL, and what it could provide, could be it as it gives clubs exposure, competition both south of the border as well as inter-provincial. It exposes players to the NCAA Div 1/2 level as most of the top players looking to get noticed for things like the MLS combine (many of the ones going this year played in PDL) played in the league.

Also, in regards to the deal the CSA/WFC/TFC/IMFC and MLS made last week with Canadian players coming from elite clubs before the age of 16 counting as domestic in MLS in the future, if clubs in BC want to be listed as one of those clubs, they will need to elevate their game to be considered. Right now, it is only MLS teams but if that list of clubs is to grow (which it's suppose to increase) they need ambition.

The tough question is how that works. Does a club ask its youth for a $20 (I'm just spit-balling here) increase in its registration to support the running of the club (should the CSA ask that from every player in Canada to support a CPL)? Or should it court a deep pocket investor who may want control or advertisement that doesn't always jive with club policy.

It will be interesting to see how this new team does it. It would be interesting to know how BC clubs in the past have done it. Highlanders had deep pockets. Abbotsford????
 
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