India as a footballing nation.....

Fastshow

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With the sudden deluge of self-proclaimed 'brown soccer banterers' on TTP, maybe some of you can answer me this; why the fcuk is India so rubbish at football at world level? This isn't a piss-take but a question that has plagued my very being for too long now. I see Indians playing football every weekend in the parks around here and we all know about the number who play in Vancouver so what's the deal? Why is the Indian national side so shite? Why, given the fact Indians have now been living in the UK for so long, aren't there any Indian players even in the lower echelons of the Nationwide League, nevermind the Premiership? The level of organisation in the Vancouver area in the Indian footballing community has always impressed me and has produced some superb players, particularly in the past ten years so why can't a country with a population the size of India's produce a better world product?

I know cricket is the passion in many parts of India but surely the law of averages, given such a massive population, should be putting out better players? It just doesn't add up or have I, as usual, missed something profound?
 

Ankle Breaker

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Hey

I agree that India is not good internationally. A lot of it has to do with lack of support and financing. They have the same problem as Canada does. Moreover, there is a lot of racism in the UK and it is hard to get in there.
 

Hands of Stone

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Tell that to all the Black Players of Arssnil

Originally posted by Ankle Breaker
Moreover, there is a lot of racism in the UK and it is hard to get in there.
There is a lot of racism in European football, just look at all the problems that teams have had with black players and how fans treat them.
But if you are a strong enough player, you will be playing in the top leagues, just look at all the African Players that are in the EPL right now, especially Arssnil, an allmost all black line-up, with only the Keeper (whites make the best keepers) and a defender the only non-black players.
They are in first right now with that team.

HOS
 

Rangerforever

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Do they have any type of pro league in India?
That and gov't sponsorship go a long way in my mind.

I do know that in Glasgow there is quite a good "Asian" footballing community and Big Eck just recently attended an Asian Glasgow Cup and he was quite supportive.

Funny, in the UK "Asians" are Pakistanis and Indians whereas here they're more viewed as being from the Orient.

I agree with Fasty, if there's such good support here in Canada and the UK why isn't there more players doing a Hargreaves and going back and playing for India?

I also agree with HOS on the racism thing.
Bollocks.
If you're good enough they will take you.
Maybe there could be more shite with the Browns as opposed to the Blacks as I was over when they went fcuking mental in Oldham and burnt that Pub down.
But still, you can't play the "R" card on this one IMO.

Anyhoo, if you're ever in Glasgow, go to The Shinaz, which is on Sauchiehall Street I think, because the Tandoori cuisine served up with a harsh Glasgow accent cannae be beat. ;)
 

Hands of Stone

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Originally posted by Fastshow
... given such a massive population, should be putting out better players? It just doesn't add up or have I, as usual, missed something profound?
India and China have not faired well internationaly, and they are the two largest (population) nations in the world. With some money put into soccer programs, you would think they could produce some of the best players in the world.
But does large population accompanied by financial backing make a great national team and/or program.
Probably not.

Africian teams that are some of the poorest soccer federations, have produced some great players, and some of the teams have done very well on the world stage.

Sweden, with a very small population compared to other top soccer nations, does very well internationaly, but has the programs to back it.

I think the bottom line is, Northern Europen Nations are going to continue dominating at the World level, and other Nations with Large populations should concentrate on Cricket or Ping Pong.

HOS
 

Fastshow

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agreed.......

The fact that India doesn't, apparently, spend a lot of money on their football shouldn't matter as HOS points out. Can't be a lot of wonga floating about in Senegal. For me it simply has to be more of a cultural issue as in India arguably the world's best batsman at this time, Tendulkar, has risen to the status of demi-God and has been given access to all the riches that go with it. As I previously mentioned, is it not just as simple as football playing a far distant second or even third fiddle (or sitar) to cricket and hockey?

And while it's easy and tidy to play the race card, that doesn't wash either as one popular debate in the English sports papers is whether an all-black English side would beat a team made up of all-white Englishmen. Chances are they would with the black England side only struggling in goal, as the surprisingly lucid HOS once again points out. Black Englishmen complain bitterly about playing in Europe as it's generally only on the continent that they experience any racial abuse and the instances of anything racially orientated kicking off in this country these days are few and far between.

Bend it like Beckham came out last year and that was about an Asian girl who played football against her family's wishes so where are the guys?

Could it be that Indian populations, outside India, tend to stay very close together and don't venture outside their tightly-knit communities? That's, obviously, a sweeping generalisation but...........

Even the Chinese have produced some players who currently ply their trade in the Nationwide league.
 

Gaffa

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Bury!!

The Indian captain and his mate were both playing at Bury a couple of years ago. I don't think they faired so well.

Most countries have two or three major sports. India has cricket and field hockey. Cricket is a religion in India. It means more to them than baseball will ever be to the yanks. Its like soccer in Brazil. Add that to the fact that India is still a very poor country with %90 of its people living in what we would regard as total poverty and the picture starts to take shape.

I'm sure once FIFA has conquered the US, Africa and East Asia, India, Pakistan et al will be in the firing line...

To all the APNA..."Chucka de Farte" on the weekend boys!

GaffatheGora!!
 

kt6

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politics

A big reason for the Indian National team fareing so poorly is polotics. The government has rule and stipulation that only allow a certrain number of players from each state to play on the national squad. Therefore not always the best player are fielded at the international level. Funding I think is still important as well since soccer is not a national sport in india, the limited amount of funding is spent on cricket or field hockey. Without funding there are no facilities or coahing. Indian does have a huge population but that means nothing if none of the population is playing soccer or the small fraction that is, doesn't have the coaching or facilities to develop there talents. In countries in africa there is still some sort of pay off for kids to due well in soccer, but in india there is very little payoff and a kid with potentiall will probably be sent to work rather than develop his potential.

As for indian players in canada and the UK, i don't feel that they are at the level yet to make pro's. I think the Indian community is just know starting to realize that in order for children to develop their full potential they need to play more than just a communtiy level of soccer. More and more indian kids are now playing at metro, and provincial levels and some are breaking the youth national teams. I think the community is now heading towards the right path and it will be only a matter of a few years before they slowly start breaking into the pro level.
 

Rangerforever

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KT6: Great first post.

I'm unsure now if players from here or the UK would even be allowed to play for India given your regional format argument.
Interesting that each region must have representation.

For a moment there when you were talking politics I thought maybe you were on about the Nations Cup here until I read further. :D

Anyway, welcome to TTP.

RF
 

Fastshow

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nice one.......

kt6, well put and quality first TTP post. To alter the subject of this thread slightly, I'm still at a loss as to why players of Indian origin have yet to crack into either the Premiership or it's rubbish and piss-easy Scottish equivalent. ;) I don't know whether or not you're in a position to comment on Indians living in the UK but there have to be at least two or three generations of those with Indian heritage who have, in all likelihood, never stepped foot in India itself and who consider themselves English so the cultural argument should be out the window, shouldn't it? The English cricket side is now captained by an 'Indian' (from Essex) and from what I know of the English hockey team, they're mostly of Indian ethnicity as well but given the fact this country's number one sporting pursuit is football (and by a very large margin), surely more and more Indians will have been subjected (for wont of a better word) to the football-mad schooling of the rest of the UK's kids (apart from the toffs who only play rugby and bugger each other senseless before, during and afterwards and, when they've had enough of all that, join the Conservative Party)? Why hasn't any of this worn off? It has in Vancouver as witnessed by the quality of the Indian sides in the VMSL and (the Scottish Premiership equivalent) FVSL.

Enquiring minds and all that.........
 

Jinky

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Is Harpal Singh still at Leeds?

He's brilliant on Championship Manager.
However that's make believe.
 
D

dipperripper

Hey Fastshow

With regards to your comments, I believe that it is very hard to "get in". No real player has broken through yet. Moreover, I honestly don't know if the Indian players are good enough to play at that level. I have yet to see anyone that good. I hope that someday we do have a player in the Premier league in England or Div 1. A number of Indian kids do play soccer so I belive that is just a matter of time
 

Raiguy

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Just to let you guys know there are a few indian players on the brink of playing in the premier league......Harpal Singh is on the Leeds squad...while Michael Chopra is signed by Newcastle.....both are said to be vying for title of 1st asian(aka indian) player in the premiership
 

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