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2017 Whitecaps
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I don't think I'm naive, but as I mentioned in an earlier post,
"If the team is winning & playing well. They are good players."
"If the team is losing & not playing well, they fire the coach."
That's the reality of professional sports.
I don't agree with your comment that "it's fun to watch."
I watch all of the games & it frustrates me to see them passing in their own half always backwards or sideways. Then boot the ball over the top for a player to chase.
It frustrates me to see players not working hard enough to get back & defend.
That comes down to the Coach.
Robbo has had enough time to bring in the players he wants & mould the team into the way he wants them to play.
If it is in fact the front office who are bringing in the players without his consent (which I doubt) then he should still have an influence on the way they play.
If the players are not executing the style of play that he wants, then he is not getting through to them.
If you are happy with the style of play, the effort that the players are putting in, the tactics & the results, then I would suggest that you are easily pleased.
Since their time in MLS the Whitecaps have not progressed as well as Montreal, or Toronto imho.
Maybe the front office have too much of a say in the team selection, we don't really know that.
But Robbo is in a job that he is no doubt aware of that is result based & performance based, after all it is partly entertainment.
The decline in the number of people turning up for games may tell the tale that all is not well & soccer fans are starting to "stay away."
I'm aware of a good number of "Soccer People" who have not renewed their season tickets.
The reason I here most is "It's not exiting to watch."
Schweinsteiger*31
Member
Clearly you didn't read my post properly - the part that was inside ( ). It is A LOT more fun to watch a team with a philosophy/approach to try to play the game (as well as get a result obviously) rather than a defensive, negative approach (i.e. Manchester United coached by Mourinho). And just to be clear I'm not referring to the way Caps have played this season. Just look at teams like Dallas and Portland.
Oh I didn't think professional soccer players at this level need to constantly be reminded to work hard and come back to defend. I didn't know the manager (who needs to account for and think about hundreds of things per match week) should also be accountable and be able to control a player's work rate and effort once he crosses the white line onto the pitch...WTF? FFS "working hard" and "turning up" doesn't even require any coaching, skill, or experience.
He only has influence/choice with what the owners give him to work with...which again is not much. If you claim to watch every game and talk to people then you should be well aware that the front office is not willing to come anywhere close in terms of risks and budget compared to clubs like Toronto, Montreal, and even Atlanta. You think Robbo didn't want to bring a R.Keane or a Schweinsteiger to Vancouver and preferred to bring in Shea and Montero? To compare Caps' progress with Toronto/Montreal in the first place is wrong when the front office and especially their actions doesn't show they want progress- and then to blame it on the manager...
Clearly you didn't read my post properly - the part that was inside ( ). It is A LOT more fun to watch a team with a philosophy/approach to try to play the game (as well as get a result obviously) rather than a defensive, negative approach (i.e. Manchester United coached by Mourinho). And just to be clear I'm not referring to the way Caps have played this season. Just look at teams like Dallas and Portland.
Oh I didn't think professional soccer players at this level need to constantly be reminded to work hard and come back to defend. I didn't know the manager (who needs to account for and think about hundreds of things per match week) should also be accountable and be able to control a player's work rate and effort once he crosses the white line onto the pitch...WTF? FFS "working hard" and "turning up" doesn't even require any coaching, skill, or experience.
He only has influence/choice with what the owners give him to work with...which again is not much. If you claim to watch every game and talk to people then you should be well aware that the front office is not willing to come anywhere close in terms of risks and budget compared to clubs like Toronto, Montreal, and even Atlanta. You think Robbo didn't want to bring a R.Keane or a Schweinsteiger to Vancouver and preferred to bring in Shea and Montero? To compare Caps' progress with Toronto/Montreal in the first place is wrong when the front office and especially their actions doesn't show they want progress- and then to blame it on the manager...
I thought I read your post properly.
What exactly is Robbo's philosophy?
Are you seriously comparing watching Manchester United & the Whitecaps & preferring to watch the Whitecaps?
I'm not a Manchester United fan, but that statement amuses me.
So, you don't think professional players need to be reminded that they need to work hard & come back to defend?
I would argue that it is the coaches responsibility to make sure that his players put in the effort & defend properly.
Have you ever worked with professional players?
It's not "Football Fantasy Manager" we are playing here.
You don't just pick players that you think might play well together, then just let them get on with it.
The coach should be responsible for the work rate & effort once a player crosses the white line.
If they don't put in effort, they shouldn't be crossing the white line to get on the field.
I don't think there are many coaches around the world that get to bring in the players they want.
Everyone would want a Messi or Ronaldo, but don't get them.
I'm sure that Robbo has some say in who gets signed at the club.
Wasn't it Robbo who was scouting in South & Central America not too long ago?
Seems to me that he's got some of the players he scouted, not the front office scouting them.
The team is not playing well or getting results.
What do you suggest should happen?
@Schweinsteiger*31: it's predictable because he's proven to be a shitty coach. Naive? Well, considering I've also been calling for a complete housecleaning, I think I've kinda covered the same jihad you appear to be on.
Anyhow.....
Yea bro, have you ever coached bro? I work with Pros Bro....
I have coached a bit.
But I hold up my hands in surrender.
After all this is "Take the Piss".
Clearly you didn't read my post properly - the part that was inside ( ). It is A LOT more fun to watch a team with a philosophy/approach to try to play the game (as well as get a result obviously) rather than a defensive, negative approach (i.e. Manchester United coached by Mourinho). And just to be clear I'm not referring to the way Caps have played this season. Just look at teams like Dallas and Portland.
Oh I didn't think professional soccer players at this level need to constantly be reminded to work hard and come back to defend. I didn't know the manager (who needs to account for and think about hundreds of things per match week) should also be accountable and be able to control a player's work rate and effort once he crosses the white line onto the pitch...WTF? FFS "working hard" and "turning up" doesn't even require any coaching, skill, or experience.
He only has influence/choice with what the owners give him to work with...which again is not much. If you claim to watch every game and talk to people then you should be well aware that the front office is not willing to come anywhere close in terms of risks and budget compared to clubs like Toronto, Montreal, and even Atlanta. You think Robbo didn't want to bring a R.Keane or a Schweinsteiger to Vancouver and preferred to bring in Shea and Montero? To compare Caps' progress with Toronto/Montreal in the first place is wrong when the front office and especially their actions doesn't show they want progress- and then to blame it on the manager...
No one here is going to argue with your premise that the Whitecaps are fcuking around with 1-1.5 million dollar DP's while their rivals sign 5-6 million dollar DP's. The manager can only manage what he has.
That said, there isn't a manager on the planet that has achieved any kind of success without worrying about the work rate of his players. I realize it's just one of many player characteristics on Football Manager, but it's hugely important in the real world. If you're willing to yank a player for dogging it - particularly if it's a player who's supposed to be one of your best - you send a great message to the rest of the team about holding everyone to the same standard of accountability. If you want everyone pulling the rope in the same direction, it's a great way to inspire that, with the added bonus that you might actually get said impact player to pull his head out of his ass and smarten up.
Coaching isn't just x's and o's and talent. You have to maximize what you're getting out of the talent you have. I don't think Robbo does that, which only serves to exacerbate the talent deficiencies on this squad.
Having said all of that.... Yordy Reyna my goodness...
Last nights game was a treat and it feels so much better leaving the game with a smile rather than shaking my head wondering why I am paying money to frustrate myself. Reyna gives us something to look forward to when going to games.
Schweinsteiger*31
Member
@Jigsaw I hope you're trying to ttp- otherwise your level of comprehension is worse than a high school kid...maybe have another read so you don't conclude things like a comparison of caps to Man U...
I would say his philosophy is to try play the game and to win every game. Instead of changing his tactics and formation every game to neutralize the opponent's strengths and play negative football (like many coaches do in MLS), he actually makes positive decisions/substitutions to try set up the team and give them the best chance to win the game. Yes, some of the players are nowhere near good enough, they've played like crap in the last couple seasons, and some of his decisions has led to points lost as a result of wanting to win games. It's the players who haven't executed. If he had a squad like Portland, Dallas, Chicago, LA, Toronto, Atlanta (which he doesn't because of the owners)- they would win a lot more games, and the fans would be entertained. Just look at the roster of those clubs and compare.
It's easy to point the finger at Robbo and get rid of him because it's just a manager to replace, but it won't change anything as the problem is the lack of quality of the players and support from the owners to get better ones. Besides, who do you have in mind that can replace him and be confident that he would do better?
In a given game if your team COLLECTIVELY is being outworked, of course it is his responsibility to tell the players know and make adjustments to raise the intensity/work rate. However, if certain player(s) need to be constantly reminded to work hard and defend, then measures should be taken to make sure they change their attitude or get rid of them. Perfect example of this was Morales. Robbo did a great job to scout him and bring him in, and he won newcomer of the year in his first season. Then his work rate dropped, he got benched and then released.
I would say his philosophy is to try play the game and to win every game. Instead of changing his tactics and formation every game to neutralize the opponent's strengths and play negative football (like many coaches do in MLS), he actually makes positive decisions/substitutions to try set up the team and give them the best chance to win the game. Yes, some of the players are nowhere near good enough, they've played like crap in the last couple seasons, and some of his decisions has led to points lost as a result of wanting to win games. It's the players who haven't executed. If he had a squad like Portland, Dallas, Chicago, LA, Toronto, Atlanta (which he doesn't because of the owners)- they would win a lot more games, and the fans would be entertained. Just look at the roster of those clubs and compare.
It's easy to point the finger at Robbo and get rid of him because it's just a manager to replace, but it won't change anything as the problem is the lack of quality of the players and support from the owners to get better ones. Besides, who do you have in mind that can replace him and be confident that he would do better?
In a given game if your team COLLECTIVELY is being outworked, of course it is his responsibility to tell the players know and make adjustments to raise the intensity/work rate. However, if certain player(s) need to be constantly reminded to work hard and defend, then measures should be taken to make sure they change their attitude or get rid of them. Perfect example of this was Morales. Robbo did a great job to scout him and bring him in, and he won newcomer of the year in his first season. Then his work rate dropped, he got benched and then released.
@Jigsaw I hope you're trying to ttp- otherwise your level of comprehension is worse than a high school kid...maybe have another read so you don't conclude things like a comparison of caps to Man U...
I would say his philosophy is to try play the game and to win every game. Instead of changing his tactics and formation every game to neutralize the opponent's strengths and play negative football (like many coaches do in MLS), he actually makes positive decisions/substitutions to try set up the team and give them the best chance to win the game. Yes, some of the players are nowhere near good enough, they've played like crap in the last couple seasons, and some of his decisions has led to points lost as a result of wanting to win games. It's the players who haven't executed. If he had a squad like Portland, Dallas, Chicago, LA, Toronto, Atlanta (which he doesn't because of the owners)- they would win a lot more games, and the fans would be entertained. Just look at the roster of those clubs and compare.
It's easy to point the finger at Robbo and get rid of him because it's just a manager to replace, but it won't change anything as the problem is the lack of quality of the players and support from the owners to get better ones. Besides, who do you have in mind that can replace him and be confident that he would do better?
In a given game if your team COLLECTIVELY is being outworked, of course it is his responsibility to tell the players know and make adjustments to raise the intensity/work rate. However, if certain player(s) need to be constantly reminded to work hard and defend, then measures should be taken to make sure they change their attitude or get rid of them. Perfect example of this was Morales. Robbo did a great job to scout him and bring him in, and he won newcomer of the year in his first season. Then his work rate dropped, he got benched and then released.
1) Robbo makes his substitutions with Pavlovian consistency. I must be watching different games than you if you think that he makes "positive decisions" to try to influence the game. At best, he's Mr. Dithers. At worst, he hasn't a clue...
2) Fat Sigi.
Rangerforever
Well-Known Member
Agreed.
Sorry MTKB - Hoping this is TTP.
Sorry MTKB - Hoping this is TTP.
Agreed, although sometimes he really throws a wrench in things, and puts in Hurtado when we're up by 1 and trying to hold on. At least he gave us a brief direct comparison of where we were, and where we are in terms of quality - Hurtado vs Reyna.
This.
Of course he's managing to win, what manager isn't? Doesn't mean he actually has a clue how.
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